Russia and the West

[Pensacane]

As an American, my view of Russia in relation to the West is obscured. I know differences exist between "the West" (US, Western Europe) and Russia. I would like to discuss what those differences are. (cultural and idealogical)

Also, does Russia see a need to join the West economically and politically as it often sees Islamic nations to the south and China as threats? Or could Russia be holding on to old suspicions due to the perceived threat from the West?

[Alex_Ivanov]

Originally Posted by Pensacane

Or could Russia be holding on to old suspicions due to the perceived threat from the West?

When we begin to think that threat from the West is buried in the past, West immediately reminds us the theat is still there.

[sorent]

threat? who? germany? finland? awful extra dangerous latvians? so who has attacked you before from west, and still is dangerous?

please be very specific about threat from west. (i personally believe, that in the next war agressor will be russia, but hopefully i won't live long enough to find it out)

[Pensacane]

Remind you how? Russia has been in an extremlely vulnerable position in the recent past. Did we attack you or undermine you economically? No we invested and still do. Not to mention that although agreement is not a given, Putin and Bush do have a good and personal relation.

[omygod]

Originally Posted by sorent

please be very specific about threat from west.

Hammering the final nail into the coffin of Russia

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Russians Sense the Heat of Cold War
Intensifying U.S. Criticism of Government and Its Role in Region Provokes Resentment

By Peter Finn
Washington Post Foreign Service
Monday, April 3, 2006; Page A14

"...Russians widely believe that U.S. programs to promote democracy in Ukraine, Georgia and Belarus are a Trojan horse intended to sideline Russia and expand NATO.

Academics point to reports such as one released recently by the Council on Foreign Relations: "To ease Russian pressure on neighboring states," it said, "the United States should work to accelerate those states' integration into the West."

"We are gradually being pushed to the northeast of the Eurasian continent away from the seas . . . to the place where the depths of freezing is more than two meters," said Natalia Narochnitskaya, vice chairman of the international affairs committee in the State Duma, the lower house of Russia's parliament, and a member of the nationalist Rodina Party.

She rues the loss of the three Baltic states to European Union and NATO membership and the possible loss of Russia's naval presence on the Black Sea.

"The messianism of American foreign policy is a remarkable thing," she said. When Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice speaks, Narochnitskaya said, "it seems like Khrushchev reporting to the party congress: 'The whole world is marching triumphantly toward democracy but some rogue states prefer to stay aside from that road, etc. etc.' "...

In Washington and European Union capitals, the (gas) cutoff was seen as punishment for Yushchenko's Western orientation, particularly his desire to bring Ukraine into NATO.

For Russia, such a move would be anathema. The defense and civilian industries of the two countries remain closely intertwined, and Russia's Black Sea fleet is based in the Crimea on Ukrainian territory.

"The idea of admitting Ukraine into NATO is hammering the final nail into the coffin of Russia as an independent great power," Rogov said. "We go out, you go in. Unfortunately, it's almost a consensus in Russia that the West is trying to isolate Russia."

[henrylee100]

Originally Posted by sorent

threat? who? germany? finland? awful extra dangerous latvians? so who has attacked you before from west, and still is dangerous?

please be very specific about threat from west. (i personally believe, that in the next war agressor will be russia, but hopefully i won't live long enough to find it out)

depends on what you mean by dangerous. The US for one seems like a very dangerous state at the moment with their policies of agressive expansion and democratization by force. I'd like to remind you that back when Gorby agreed to let go of East Germany and Eastern Europe Washington promised him in return that NATO would not expand eastward and that the "freed" eastern european states would remain "neutral". Naturally Gorby was either stupid enough or oiled enough not to ask for this promise to be made out in writing because sure enough NATO has been expanding big time. Today in order to get from Russian to the Kaliningrad region by train we need to have travel passports and get transit visas from Lithuania.
I personally don't particularly like the Kremli gang (cause that's what they are, a bunch of cheap thugs) and there's a host of issues about Russian that I'm not at all fond of, but the west, or let as be more specific the US, seem intent on making the lives of ordinary Russians even more miserable.

[American Metal]

Originally Posted by henrylee100

depends on what you mean by dangerous. The US for one seems like a very dangerous state at the moment with their policies of agressive expansion and democratization by force. I'd like to remind you that back when Gorby agreed to let go of East Germany and Eastern Europe Washington promised him in return that NATO would not expand eastward and that the "freed" eastern european states would remain "neutral". Naturally Gorby was either stupid enough or oiled enough not to ask for this promise to be made out in writing because sure enough NATO has been expanding big time. Today in order to get from Russian to the Kaliningrad region by train we need to have travel passports and get transit visas from Lithuania.
I personally don't particularly like the Kremli gang (cause that's what they are, a bunch of cheap thugs) and there's a host of issues about Russian that I'm not at all fond of, but the west, or let as be more specific the US, seem intent on making the lives of ordinary Russians even more miserable.

I'm not so sure about that, because it seems that WE in the U.S. have become the aggressors.