Let's talk about the Crimean tatar issue....

[Tebriz-will-Rise]

an act of genocide by Josef Stalin deported an entire race from their homeland.

There are 5 million Crimeans worldwide.

Crimea is part of Ukraine right now. the Ukrainian govnt has allowed Crimeans to return back to their homeland.

My question is why is Russia not allowing this?
Isn't Ukraine an independant nation?
Why meddle into foreign countries policies on their own world recognised territory?
Can we call it imperialism still alive?

Why treat the tatars as second class citizens? why take away all their rights after the tatar genocide?

[KLange]

Originally posted by Tebriz-will-Rise
an act of genocide by Josef Stalin deported an entire race from their homeland.

There are 5 million Crimeans worldwide.

Crimea is part of Ukraine right now. the Ukrainian govnt has allowed Crimeans to return back to their homeland.

My question is why is Russia not allowing this?
Isn't Ukraine an independant nation?
Why meddle into foreign countries policies on their own world recognised territory?
Can we call it imperialism still alive?

Why treat the tatars as second class citizens? why take away all their rights after the tatar genocide?

Ukraine is an independent country, I don't see why Russia would try to prevent the Crimean Tatars returning. It's a Ukrainian matter, not Russian. Are you talking about the Russian community in Crimea? Aren't the Crimean Tatars descendants of the Mongols and the Turkic tribes they incorporated, such as the Cumans or Kipchaks intermixed with the Greek, Alanic (Iranic), and GOthic inhabitants of the Crimea?

[Tebriz-will-Rise]

Crimeans are Turkic peoples.

Ukraine has allowed them to come back. Russia is trying it's best to stop it. I am not talking about the Russian people who live in Crimea but Putin's govnt. it's started a small sort of conflict in the black sea area between Ukraine and Russia.

Russia is using the Russian ethnics there to try and recapture crimea back into the russian empire.

Ukraine on the other hand says it will provide all the 5 million crimean tatars to come back home provided that they learn ukranian and not seek separation. The Crimean Tatar Meclis has agreed to the conditions. Of course, it does not provide them to come home within a year but a long period of time similar to the jews returning back home to Israel.

Dating back to world war II there was obviously a reason for why the entire race was massacured or deported from crimea. It's got nothing to do with racial issues but rather territorial claims. It's not possible that josef Stalin would use so much money and time to "deport" people because of siding with the "nazi's". Stalin was a pure Russian nationalist. I am trying to figure out why crimea is so valuable to the russian nationalists. A lot of russians still claim crimea as a "russian" land even though it's legally a part of Ukraine.

[Tebriz-will-Rise]

1441- After the disintegration of the Golden Horde Empire, Haci Giray Khan, a direct descendent of Ghengis Khan, established the independent Crimean Khanate. The Giray dynasty ruled Crimea without interruption until April 8, 1783.
1660 - Yuri Krizhanich, a Croation nationalist and a Pan-Slavist, was the first person to recognize the geostrategic importance of the Crimea, and recommended its annexation by the tsarist Russia. Since 1660, therefore, to conquer Crimea and have a "Crimea without Crimean Tatars" was a Russian political goal which was also adopted by the Bolshevik regime.
April 8, 1783 - Russia officially annexed Crimea; thus, the first part of the Russian political goal was accomplished by Catherine II. Due to the oppressive tsarist policy towards the Crimean Tatar people, hundreds and thousands of Crimean Tatars left their homeland in waves of massive emigrations. The Crimean Tatar population which was estimated to be over five million during the height of the Crimean Khanate rule, decreased to less than 300,000 on the eve of the Bolshevik Revolution. Crimean Tatars were made a "minority" in their ancestral homeland.
April 10, 1883- Ismail Gaspirali, the Crimean Tatar journalist and educator, launched his crusade to awaken not only the conscience of his people, but the conscience of the entire Muslim peoples of Russia, by publishing the bilingual (Crimean Tatar and Russian) newspaper Tercuman in Bahcesaray, Crimea. Ismail Gaspirali also introduced a new system of education, usul-u cedid, which helped reduce illiteracy in the Crimea and among Muslim people in Russia.
November 28, 1917 -Under the leadership of Numan Celebi Cihan, an independent Crimea was established but it lasted less than six months.
October 18, 1921 - The Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic (Crimean ASSR) was established with a special order from V.L Lenin. From 1921 until 1927, the Crimean Tatars lived their golden age under the leadership of Veli Ibrahim during which the Crimean Tatar nationalism flourished. The golden age of Crimean Tatar nationalism ended in 1927 when Veli Ibrahim and his colleagues were arrested and executed for being "Bourgeois nationalists." Thousands of Crimean Tatars perished during the deportation of rich peasants, the Kulaks. The Crimean Tatar alphabet was changed twice, in 1928 from Arabic script to Latin script, and in 1938 from Latin script to Cyrillic script. The Crimean Tatar political elite and intellectuals were liquidated during this period.
May 18, 1944 - The entire Crimean Tatar population, mostly women, children and the elderly, was rounded up, loaded on trucks and taken to the nearest train station to be loaded onto cattle wagons and shipped off to Urals, Siberia and mostly to Uzbekistan in Central Asia. Due to hunger, thirst and diseas, 46.2% of the total Crimean Tatar population perished during this forced deportation. The survivors of this tragic event were forced to live in "Special Settlement Camps." Thus, the second and final stage of the Russian political goal, which was to annex Crimea and ethnically cleanse Crimea of Crimean Tatars, was accomplished."
April 28, 1956 - The Crimean Tatars were officially released from the "Special Settlement Camps" during Nikita S. Khruschev's DeStalinization era. Even though they were not totally rehabilitated, this limited freedom was sufficient for Crimean Tatars to launch one of the most peaceful and daring human rights movements in the history of the Soviet Union. The Crimean Tatar National Movement began with individual letter writing and telegram sending; thousands of letters and telegrams were sent to various organs of the Communist Party. This campaign changed to petition-sending campaign; and from 1957 to 1961 six petitions containing 5 to 8,000 signatures were sent to Soviet authorities. During the height of this campaign in 1966, a petition containing 120,000 signatures and 37 volumes of documents on Crimean Tatars were sent to the 23rd Party Congress held in Moscow.
September 5, 1967 - An official decree promulgated on this date exonerated the Crimean Tatars from any wrong doing during World War II. Thousands of Crimean Tatars attempted to return to Crimea and those who returned found that they were not welcomed in their ancestral homeland. Thousands of Crimean Tatar families, once again, were deported from Crimea by the local authorities.
Mustafa Jemilev protested Soviet government's treatment of the Crimean Tatar people by declaring a hunger strike that lasted 275 consecutive days in 1976.
On June 28, 1978, to dramatize Soviet government's treatment of his family and people, Musa Mamut, father of three young children, committed suicide by self-immolation. Despite all the opposition from the government and the people who replaced Crimean Tatars in Crimea, 1,200 Crimean Tatar families succeeded in resettling in Crimea.
April 11-12, 1987 - The first All-Union meeting of the Crimean Tatar "Action Groups", was held in Tashkent. It was during this meeting that the Crimean Tatars decided to appeal to the new leadership in Moscow to resolve their problem once and for all. A petition with 40,000 signatures was sent to Secretary General Mikael S. Gorbachev demanding to meet with him.
July 3 & 23, 1987 - Over 2,000 Crimean Tatar representatives from the entire Soviet Union gathered in Moscow's Red Square demanding to meet with Secretary General Gorbachev personally. This is said to be the largest demonstration held in Red Square since the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917.
April 29 - May 2, 1989 - All-Union meeting of the "Action Groups" resulted in the formation of OKND (Organizatsya Krmskotatarskogo Natsyonal-nogo Divijenya), the Crimean Tatar National Movement Organization. This was the first political party since Milli Firka of 1917. Mustafa Jemilev was elected as chairman of OKND.
June 26-30, 1991 - The historic Second Crimean Tatar National Kurultay (parliament) was convened in Akmescit (Simferopol) for the first time since 1917 to review the future of the Crimean Tatar people. A 33-member Crimean Tatar National Mejlis (the Executive Board/ Cabinet) was formed, and Mustafa Jemilev was elected as its first chairman. On June 30, 1991, the Crimean Tatar National Mejlis declared the sovereignty of Crimean Tatars, and adopted the Crimean Tatar's national anthem and the national flag. Also, in a special declaration, the Mejlis appealed to all the citizens of Crimea, regardless of religion and nationality, to join them in building a new Crimea.
July 27, 1993 - The Third Crimean Tatar National Kurultay was convened in Akmescit (Simferopol).
November 28-30, 1993 - A Special Kurultay was convened to decide on whether or not to participate in the upcoming parliamentary elections and elect 14 Crimean Tatar Deputies to the Crimean Parliament. Also, to decide on whether or not to participate in the presidential election. After lengthy discussions Kurultay decided to participate in both elections.
March 29, 1994 - On this historic date the Crimean Tatars elected 14 Crimean Tatar Deputies to the Crimean Parliament. For the first time in fifty years the Crimean Tatars had legal representation in the Crimean Parliament.
The most recent political crisis in the Crimea, created by president Yuri Meshkov when he attempted to dissolve the Crimean Parliament, was beneficial for the Crimean Tatars. One of the five Deputy Prime Ministers (Ilmi Umerov), the Minister of Social Affairs (Edem Ennanov) and the chairman of the International Relations Committee (Osman Adamanov) in the new coalition government of Prime Minister Fravchuk, are Crimean Tatars.

The Crimean Tatars have come a long way from being declared a non people fifty years ago to sharing power in the current Crimean government, which is progress indeed. All this progress, however, means very little to the majority of the Crimean Tatars who are still living in exile. The real effort now should be directed to returning remaining Crimean Tatars to Crimea

[Andrej_]

Very sad, I see this topic is of special interest to you, it itches so badly eh ? Well heres the thing, Crimea was a wedding gift in a broken marrige, but Russia never got the gift back, in any case... The thing is, Ukraine is only acting in its own interest, just as Russia, do you seriously fail to understand why Russia would want to keep the Tatars out ? Let me break one thing to you though, lifes a bitc'h, you can't make me care about the Crimean Tatars, not my blood, I hope you understand. Ive stumbled across so many topics, just look at the Baltics. I hear people cry about their uncles being deported to Siberia, even though Gulags were mostly populated by ethnic Russians. I hear people cry of genocides, and you know what, I won't even argue, sure whatever you say, heck lets hugg and kiss in solidarity, I feel sorry for you loss, I really do, but what the fuc'k do you want from me ? In all likelyhood I lost more relatives to the Soviets then any Tatar, now whos going to pay my reparations ? So now my 18 year old Great Uncle who died liberating Riga is a war criminal ? Your a Turk, you should know, think... 'Armenian Genocide'... How can you be so blind ? Once again what the fuc'k do you want from me bre ?

[Bahadur]

Originally posted by Andrej_
Very sad, I see this topic is of special interest to you, it itches so badly eh ? Well heres the thing, Crimea was a wedding gift in a broken marrige, but Russia never got the gift back, in any case... The thing is, Ukraine is only acting in its own interest, just as Russia, do you seriously fail to understand why Russia would want to keep the Tatars out ? Let me break one thing to you though, lifes a bitc'h, you can't make me care about the Crimean Tatars, not my blood, I hope you understand. Ive stumbled across so many topics, just look at the Baltics. I hear people cry about their uncles being deported to Siberia, even though Gulags were mostly populated by ethnic Russians. I hear people cry of genocides, and you know what, I won't even argue, sure whatever you say, heck lets hugg and kiss in solidarity, I feel sorry for you loss, I really do, but what the fuc'k do you want from me ? In all likelyhood I lost more relatives to the Soviets then any Tatar, now whos going to pay my reparations ? So now my 18 year old Great Uncle who died liberating Riga is a war criminal ? Your a Turk, you should know, think... 'Armenian Genocide'... How can you be so blind ? Once again what the fuc'k do you want from me bre ?

There's no Anrmenian Genocide.
There was a conflict between Turks and Armenians in the region-East Anatolia- After Serves Peace Conference Ottoman Empire is required to give East Anatolia to Armenians to found an Armenian state in the region. And Armenian gangs started to attack Turks in the region. Ottoman Empire decided to move Armenians south to Syria and let them found their state there not in East Anatolia. Because of these transportations many Armenians died because of hunger, thirst, cold and diseases in the journeys. By the way some of them were killed by Turks because they kept attacking Turks even though They were being carried.
No genocide/////////////////////////////
That is the truth.
No one shooted them or slaughtered them,
They died of hunger, thirst. cold or diseases.

[Andrej_]

You fool, learn to read, I don't care about that, but you supported my point very well... There was no TurkoSoviet Genocide either, just an active campaign of state terror, under which 60 million perished, Turkish, Russian, regardless.