They call THIS an "Army"???

[akhmetbek]

Murder and mayhem cull ranks of Russian army
October 3 2002





The Russian soldiers were caught napping when a burst of automatic gunfire shot up their dugout in the Caucasus Mountains. Two shadows slipped into the valley below, leaving eight corpses behind.

Officials at first blamed the usual suspects - rebels from nearby Chechnya.

But then the investigation took a different tack. After a four-day hunt involving thousands of police, privates Oleg Khismatulin and Nikolai Bozhkov were caught and confessed to killing their comrades in revenge for being hazed.

The murders in late August topped national television headlines as the bloodiest military shoot-out since February, when two Russian paratroopers fled their unit and killed 10 police officers and civilians.

It highlighted the military's worsening problem of hazing and desertions.

One desertion made news in early September because of its sheer scale: 54 soldiers left their unit in southern Russia and marched 55 kilometres to Volgograd to protest against beatings by their officers.

But most desertions go unreported. The deputy chief of the Russian General Staff, Lieutenant-General Vasily Smirnov, says 2270 servicemen fled their units during the first six months of this year and 860 remain missing. General Smirnov said 2265 deserters were at large, and some had been on the run for 10 years.

Russia's anti-conscription activists give a much higher figure - about 40,000 - and say only radical reform can improve things.

"The military degradation has gone too far to deal with through evolutionary steps," said Ida Kuklina, who is active in Soldiers' Mothers, the leading anti-draft group. "The army is the only part of Russian society that has remained virtually unreformed since Soviet times, except for shrinking in size."

Her group believes that about 3000 servicemen die every year in shootings, suicides and accidents, not counting daily casualties in the war with separatists in Chechnya.

General Smirnov said that, excluding deaths in battle, 483 servicemen died on and off duty in the first half of the year - about one-third by suicide.

Hazing starts with routine demands for young conscripts to clean toilets, wash older soldiers' socks or beg on the streets for cigarette money. The defiant or weak-willed are beaten and, in some cases, tortured, raped and killed.

The media recently reported a military prostitution ring in Moscow in which sergeants offered their men as prostitutes.

Captured deserters usually face a military tribunal and are sent to punishment units. Sometimes, the authorities simply return deserters to their units, as apparently happened to the 54 soldiers who marched to Volgograd.

Every Russian male aged 18-27 is supposed to serve two years in the military, but college deferments, health exemptions and bribes mean only 12 per cent of potential conscripts were actually called up this northern spring, compared with about 17 per cent three years ago, military officials say.

In its struggle to fill the ranks, the military routinely drafts men with mental illnesses and criminal records.

"Violence is an inherent part of the existing system," said Ms Kuklina of Soldiers' Mothers. "This problem will never be solved until the draft is abolished."

Associated Press

[Pycku_Soldat]

Shut up ROndo .... Your a !@#$ing imbicil...

Akhmet... Im surprised this is news to you... or are you trying to be some sort of a sensai for mogrels like Rondo...
Educating them in the evils of the RUskis....
Mne pokazalosi jto ti ne navidish Moskvy a ne Ruski narod.. Soldat eto Ruski narod, ne politiki ne huyitiki a patsini ka ti kogda to bil...

No one is denying that the Russian army is a harsh place... The fact is its been like this for decades.. In Russia army whips a boy into a man something these AMericanites can not relate to .... I suppose looking from their side it does seem somewhat "inhumane" but that doesnt mean that its wrong... Its just different..... And so fat it looks like its been working.... I dont really want to bring any stats up, due to the fact Id probably hurt some feelings.... But Russian army is at its top... WHat doesnt kill us only makes us stronger....

[akhmetbek]

No ,it ain't no news to me.But it is for some people...

Moskva etu armiu ne kormit i deneg ne platit.Soldati drug druga mochat.Kakaya v zopu eto armia?

[humanbeing]

you must understand what toy soldat says ronbo, russian army is just simple peasant murderers and rapist. nothing bad there, much honor in murder and rape. americans just don't understand.

[Pycku_Soldat]

Originally posted by akhmetbek
No ,it ain't no news to me.But it is for some people...

Moskva etu armiu ne kormit i deneg ne platit.Soldati drug druga mochat.Kakaya v zopu eto armia?

Kakmy ti pezdish Akhmet.... Eto vsigda tak bilo... V amrie vsegda vseh prriebali... Eto kak ne napisanie zakoni .... Starshina imet prava izdivatsya nad mladshemi.... A kogda mlasdhie stayut starshie, oni toje samoe delayut..... Iza etogo nashi patsani gordyatsa kogda oni vosrachaytsa....Doma eto kak examini v Mushiny....
Mozhet bite eto chuchuti "barbaric".... No xuy .... Eto armieya....esli ani dumayut eto ploxo , ya xotel bi posmatret jto oni b skazali pod stvulom obdolbinogo Chechentsya.....
Po etom nashi patsani garazda gatovie k komabty jem Amerikantskie pissuni.....
>>>>>>>>>>\\
SH!TBEING
Your whole post was pretty !@#$ing stupid ... other than this part
"americans just don't understand"..... your right they dont... Maybe their educational system is to blame... Maybe its all that tottaly pointless hours spent at the box... Maybe its the fat from all those burgers getting to their brains.... but your right , filth like you doesnt understand..... !@#$ing retard....

[old-reb]

Hello Soldat,

You are fighting a lost cause. Everyone knows the Russian army needs reform. Even Putin knows it and is trying to do something about it, but he is blocked by the political process.

This is how you bring about change. You open your eyes and get over the hurdles to make Russia a better world to live in.

Hey Ronbo,

That was a good report on USSR army.

old reb

[Pycku_Soldat]

REB.... you know I have alot of respect for you .....But I must disagree with you ..... Firstly with the fact that your focusing on rebuilding the Russian army.... Our army is fine... There are many things in russia that need rebuilding.... The army is least important of them... In my opinion....
As concerning the abuse and the "inhumane treatment of the lower ranked.... Well ... Reb ... just because something is done differently, doesnt mean its wrong... this has been hapenning for many decades now... this type of "abuse" is what gets the soldat prepared..... If hes scared of taking a few punchs than I cant imagine what hell do at the end of the barrel...
In Russia the army is considered as a big step towards mandhood... And the gruesome process only increases the importance of it....

I dont think you would necessarly fully understand Reb... I dont expect you to at least... i just want you to keep in mind that things are different over there... Doesnt mean theyr worse though ...... Plus.... Scars only make a man more handsome... hehehehehe....
aight Im off for today .....