Enlargement

[Kubik]

Originally posted by limey_defence
No it's not a religious club, for a start although most a christian with both Catholic and Protestant nations there are other religions inside the EU.
If you want to know why Turkey is not in the EU, it is simple. It is not a decent enough place to be part of our civilised nations. The Human rights in Turkey are appalling, they have no civil rights, in fact they have no rights at all. It is a vile nation and it has nothing to give to the EU unlike the recently joined nations. They all have potential, Turkey does not unless it starts acting civilised and learns what Human rights are.

Limey,
Being a Turk, I gotta admit that I'm also against our constantly knocking at EU's door, not that I don't appreciate the development EU achieved off course, but I'd like see my country achieve the same thing without foreign help.

About Turkey having nothing to give to the EU: It's not a country relying on agriculture or tourism only. Find some statistics about how many cars, TVs, textile products etc. EU countries are importing from Turkey and how many European companies operating in Turkey. Before the first Gulf War and embargo, we had about $5 billon a year trade volume with Iraq only. Your comment on those newly accepted dwarf countries having more to offer to EU is the joke of the day.

Regarding the human rights etc you guys are always singing the same song. But we all know that EU have just embraced Latvia with 1/3 of her citizens are Russian and Latvia is doing whatever she can to suppress this huge minority, they banned Russian language in schools, threw Russian people from their homes, there are many Russians in Baltic countries with their citizenship was cancelled on the pretext that they do not speak official language good enough. EU paid no attention to all these and accepted Latvia's membership. Now ignoring these facts and talking only about Turkey's minority rights (where there have been quite good improvement already) proves only that EU is a hypocrite club.

[limey_defence]

Really, what Turkey gained, what was that 5 billion? Wouldn't go into the EU pot. It's not just money certain other things maybe a little more helpful, political backing is one.

Turkey does not have Human Rights, we know it, you know it hell everyone knows it. The main reason the EU calls it most is because the Turkish police on a whole lack Human Rights towards anyone but mainly towards Tourists from Europe.
I'm surprised anyone even goes there from what I've heard. Women kidnapped and raped, by Police. And then people wonder why Turkey isn't accepted.

These new countries did have something to give, straight away in fact. 256 million from each country was given to Britain. Latvia may need a little boost, but I'm sure it MIGHT achieve something great, the main countries that were worth while were Poland and the Czech Republic. The others were merely to gain a stable environment in Eastern Europe.

And on your many companies in Turkey, you should see how many companies are setting up in Eastern Europe now. The Terrys (it's a choclate company, HUGE) factory in York (Over 200 years old) will be moved to Slovakia, creating Hundreds of jobs, this is going to become a trend. Cheap labour, with a country we just get the money back off...

[Tavaros_the_Greek]

Originally posted by Kubik
About Turkey having nothing to give to the EU: It's not a country relying on agriculture or tourism only. Find some statistics about how many cars, TVs, textile products etc. EU countries are importing from Turkey and how many European companies operating in Turkey. Before the first Gulf War and embargo, we had about $5 billon a year trade volume with Iraq only.


hhmm,thats kind of funny,because everyone knows that Turkey is still a very poor country if you compare it with Greece or other European countries.

The average Greek or European are fur richer and have much more higher standars of living,comparing with the average Turk.

So,kubic what you said above for companies operating in Turkey,trades with Iraq,etc. have nothing to do with the reality.The turkish economy is always in very bad situation,everyone knows that.

BTW,when a European company is operating in Turkey,this means mainly more money for Europeans, not for Turks.



Regarding the human rights etc you guys are always singing the same song.

no,we dont song any song.We just critisize the current situation in turkey and the abuse of human rights that is happening there.

[tanguero]

To me it is now a bag full of cats. Time will tell. Fright unites us and as far as I know it is not a good adhesive.

[Tavaros_the_Greek]

"fright unites us?"..lol

I dont think that fright is this, which united us

Common values,the common continent,the ambition to become stronger and have a better life unites us.

at least for me,I dont feel any fright,and I am sure the majority of the Europeans feel the same with me.

as for the "time will tell",time has already told,2-3 decades has passed and EU is always moving from better to best.I see a great future coming ahead..

[Gregz]

Kubik

Turkey which has a population of over 60 million would have considerable voting rights within the EU. However it is Turkey's movement away from secularism towards radicalism that is baring her entry.

The EU is a trade federation that serves as primarily a economic alliance.

Gregz


"The unapparent connection is more powerful than the apparent one." - Hippolytus

[Kubik]

Gregz:

<<Turkey which has a population of over 60 million would have considerable voting rights within the EU.>>
- Personally I don't care, I already expressed my opinion on our membership application in my previous post.

<<However it is Turkey's movement away from secularism towards radicalism that is baring her entry>>
- There's no such movement. There's a ruling party with religious tendencies only and they represent maximum 10-20% of the people. They were elected with 30% of the votes out of which many voters were angry with the previous coalition leaders and just to punish them they voted AKP. You're ignoring the fact that this AKP missed by an inch (as Social Democrats voted against) sending troops to participate in the Iraqi war, it is cooperating with Israel and it claims that they're facing towards the west for development. You're calling them "Radical Islamists"? I bet Osama calls them "infidels". Besides, your EU seems to be more concerned about Turkish Military than Turkish Politicians. Whatever you may think, but Army is still the strongest fortress that guarantees secularism, regardless of how minor is the possibility of deviation from secular state and I'm happy with its presence.

<<The EU is a trade federation that serves as primarily a economic alliance.>>
- No probs, if you think that way. We've already been trading with EU for quite a while. The only thing that bothers is "Quota", it is limiting the export volume we could produce. But EU is indeed more than a trade federation, otherwise why should it ignore the human right abuses currently ongoing in Latvia which it has recently embraced as a member whereas it constantly noses into my country's business when she'll never be accepted (BTW, I brought this double-standard issue into discussion above but as expected I received no logical explanations from Tavar and Limey). No Sir, there's as much of politics as trade with the EU.

That's why I believe we shoulda stay outside, use our resources to stand on our own feet and stop thinking that a EU membership will cover the losses caused by the incompetence of our politicians. We are a buffer, bridge, arbitrator, or whatever you may call, between your EU on one side and the boiling shyte-hole called ME on the other. So stoning us is not much of help to keep us playing our role.

Have a nice day