Christian(?)ity

[Mission010]

Curious, I think we are basically on the same page. As far as the church goes, the Spirit can be found in any gathering of believers, who have turned their hearts and lives over to Jesus. Whether alone, in a library, a home or a congregation of thousands.
The point I try to make is that the church has become complacent comfortable and old. They live off of what they have been taught at seminary rather than what the Spirit speaks to their heart on a day to day basis. And, if you've begun to see more churches speak by the Holy Spirit, then that is awesome, that is what I want to see!
What we need to see in the church is more of a hunger for God, rather then being content sitting in the pews on Sunday, and having potluck afterwords. If the church is unable to affect a change in its members that would lead them closer to Jesus, and the Father by the Holy spirit, if, in essence, God is not completely real and in control of our lives, then we become subject to dead doctrine. I don't believe complacency and Chritianity were to ever go hand in hand.
I do know of a church, though it is no where near my city, where people are alive, they teach by th power of the Spirit, and if the Spirit leads they may not preach at all, sometime the Spirit leads them to "corparte" prayer for hours. Sometimes they worship for hours.
If all churches were like this, more unbelievers would see the reality of the Holy Spirit and we would have more believers in Jesus. I'm calling for a higher level of purity within the church, to where it is no longer self serving, or complacent, but where everything has an eternal purpose in Jesus. I want to see this in the church!

[Curious]

Nonson,
Of course! Is not Christianity, in it's roots at least, a mystical, Eastern religion?
Words to ponder.
-Curious
p.s. Don't take that comment too deeply, it's said in fun.

[Nonson]

Dear Curious, one must maintain a sense of humor in these discussion, or one might take out a whip and flog the un-repentient. Peace

[cepguu]

Dangerous, possibly sacriligious ponderings, from a believing non-believer, as well as a non-believing believer; numero uno:

Certain revelations in the desert were, FROM THE VERY START, intended only for a tiny few, and NOT for a growing multitude leading towards ALL, as all churches, as ingrained in their very justification for existence, would have us believe.

Y dos:

Conquest (or genocide, as Tony Grinning Blaire would have defined it, had political-correctness as a ludicrously shallow concept existed in those wrathful biblical days) of Cannon, mission of Joshua, the SON himself stating to the Samaritan woman that "SALVATION CAME FROM THE JEWS... WHAT'S INTENDED FOR CHILDREN OUGHT NOT TO BE THROWN TO THE DOGS... " and so forth, points more than conclusively to a fundamentally rigid and racially ego-centric view of the universe on the part of the Jews, a trait that most other nations hardly fail to share, but was inherited with particular forcefulness by certain followers of Islam.
The Christian church, with all of their later-day humanistic semi-secular diversions, never found a way to talk straight on this little sticking point.

What, Old Jehovah a racist? That's not cool! What about multi-culturalism and all that good ****?

A SAINT COULD HAVE FLAWS, AND STILL BE A SAINT. A SON OF OF GOD MAY NOT HAVE FLAWS, AND MAY NOT FAIL.

A GOD BORN IN THE DESERT IS A WRATHFUL AND JEALOUS GOD.

CHILDREN OF A JEALOUS AND WRATHFUL GOD; REFLEXIVE INSISTENCE ON ONE AND ONLY ROAD TO SALVATION, A HABIT AND AN INSTINCT DIFFICULT TO SHAKE LOOSE. THE INSTINCT TO MONOPOLIZE ON SPIRITUAL MATTERS.

Y tres:

The complex duality of human nature, perceived strictly in terms of godliness v.s. sinfulness. Again, favored discourse of a wrathful father, likely to produce neurosis in his children, as is evident from the hordes led both by the heretic prophet Karl Marx and the flower teenagers from Haight-Ashbury.

Enough gloomy slanderings. I ask forgiveness, but not punishment or correction.

The undying light, shining upon all humanity, from the highly personalised and individualized vision of young Christ: a personal, emotional plea to unconditional love, edified by unswerving conviction and whole-hearted self-sacrifice. A feat not shared in any other philosophies or religions. God's words put into blood and flesh.

He asked, towards the end, father, why thou forsake me? But it was done, what you asked of me, it was done.

He did closely resemble, in a most beautiful and poetic way, the last, the most pure-hearted son, of a ancient and angry father. His dying eyes beseechingly gazed heavenwards, his limbs bleeding their final drops on the cross.

We never really hear much from the Father ever since. We know not whether He has been silently grieving his lost Son, or the comical imperfection of his human creation, or even his own anger, as a modern-day new-age American therapists might gleefully speculate. The church that bore His Son's name evolved into more or less a Pharasilic institution, and the Chosen People were slaughtered by the millions in our progressive century.

Against all these obviously unpromising odds, Nonson, what voices did you hear that prompted your resolution to pack up and walk into the desert, all by yourself?

[Nonson]

From encountering a number of very stiff lessons in deontic logic, such as you're presenting here in a rather lucid form. Peace

[Jennacarana]

Hello.

It seems that, thus far, there was no one here to defend Christian traditions. This is unfortunate, because there is great beauty in many of the old traditions, particularly in the older denominations - the Orthodox, Catholic, Anglican, and Luthern churches.

The big concern with a one of a you (I forgot who - Mission, maybe?) seems to be that Christianity has become stale and impersonal DUE to tradtions, rituals, etc. I admit that many of Christians have not made their faith a personal one. Certainly not all are like this - if you wish to argue THAT point I can provide dozens of examples off the top of my head, my own testimony being foremost. But this dryness is not simply due to the structure of the church - if it were something inherent to Christianity, Christianity would have crumbled centuries ago.

So what is it?

It could be any number of things: a fresh onslaught of secularism, fewer people accepting God's call to witness to others and to work in the church.

Overall though, I think its misleading and erroneous to say that Christianity as whole is any "dryer" than it was int he past. It's just "dry" in different ways (dry being defined as lacking the Living Water).

There. There's my two cents worth.

Take care.

------------------
Jenna

[Mission010]

My point is not jsut in Dissing on the church, or Christianity itself. My point is that the way many of our Churches have become are too user friendly to their congregations. We see a church system that has just become a group or Christian club, A "form of righeousness, but denying the power" of the Holy Spirit. My problem is not with the church members who really love God, and have a heart that loves Him with their whole "heart, soul, mind, and strength" but those in leaadership, and in the congregation, who would use the church to their own advantage, creating a watered down version of Christianity that is powerless.
The people who are unsaved are looking for a fulfillment in their lives, not a a church that follows worldly or doctrinal ways, but a Person who can fill their empty places. I want thenm to have such a place, and find that person in Jesus. But it is getting harder and harder to find a church that isn't more caught up in following the routine of Suday and Wednesday night services, regular teachings that haven't been Holy Spirit inspired, and a church that makes things comfortable for its members instead of pushing them onword with their Saviour. I just think God wants to begin to do a new thing, that we all can be united in, we can stop the petty denominational squabbles, and the true lovers of God can finally unite to become the Bride of Christ that He has for us to be.
I hope you understand my heart a bit better now, I just want everyone to be able to know more Truth, and to know Jesus more fully. I don't want anyone becoming hung up on doctrines of men that give an unfavorable impression of and take the power away from the simplicity of which we have in Christ. "To become even as one of these" (little children).
For His kingdom