Land of the free...home of the brave!

[carter]

Two Russians at each other's throat over Russian politics. Just like old times back in Moscow.

All I go to say is - Muskovite, Polack, Jew, stick the knife all the way through.

Is that wicked or what? It's a real ice breaker and great toast before rounds of vodka and pickles. Of course it's a joke, I was a Polish Jew (only by leniage) living in Moscow.

Vote Yablanko! Frag Putin!

[Voyager13b]

This is a long thread, so understand that this post is directed to the guy who posted the "explain this!" list of omnipresent American evil.

Comrade Stalin would be proud of that "essay". How many years of absorbing propaganda did it take for you to complete your transition from a thinking individual into a blind believer? How can it become so easy to sum up the entire soul and value of a nation in a rambling list of negative platitudes? It would be easy for me to generate an even larger list of abuse and death that falls squarely at the feet of various Soviet leaders, but what would be the point? That list would would be as poor a description of the Russian people as your ranting was of the US.

All two hundred or so of your demands for an American to "explain this!" could have easily been answered with just a little patience and research, but that was never in the plan, was it? Your conclusion was already made long before you published the "essay". It's purpose was simply to support your point of view, and not to seek understanding. Russian and American people have a great deal in common. They are a natural match for working together, in both ecomomic cooperation and competition, and in an effort to make the world a better place. Blind repetition of propaganda from either side of a war that had ended ten years ago can only serve to impede progress.

Well intentioned people sometimes do bad things. At times they can be justified, and sometimes they cannot. Peer pressure, understanding, and mutual respect are a few of the ways that good people (and nations) can be moved to do better. On the other hand, people like Saddam don't understand civility and economic growth at all. They only understand personal power, and no matter how small they are, they are capable of purchasing the means to disrupt the lives of millions. They don't give a damn about your life, my life, or the lives of the family that lives a block away from the palace.

Don't let your nostalgia for a bipolar world where the USSR painted half the globe with a red flag blind you to the reality of 2003. We are now in a multi polar world where even small dictatorships can buy technology capable of holding free nations hostage to their whims. They don't play by the same rules, and they are very dangerous to every free society.

Russia is a wonderful country. Besides being the largest country on earth, it has enormous natural resources, a sound infrastructure, and some of the best minds on the planet. Forget the Cold War, it's over. Despite the picture painted by your "essay", the US does not enslave partner nations. They are free and independent. Just ask Germany and France. Hell, France has been pried free from the jaws of the beast twice in the past 70 years with the help of it's freinds, yet it has always maintained a maddening sense of independence. No sooner than they brush the dust off of their sleeves, they are likely to tell the US to go to hell. I have yet to see reports of American bombs falling on Paris in retaliation though.

Russia does not need to revive the mindless relationship shared between the USSR and the US after the great war in order to prosper. It needs a solid partner. I think that partner is the United States. Vladimir Putin understands. George Bush understands. Think about it. Besides, if things go well for Russia during the next decade or two, it can well become the the powerhouse economy of the entire world. That would certainly help put your wounded pride at ease.

[Voyager13b]

Originally posted by vorosilov

I see you gave up Eyeradievichevsky,

You surrendered. Red Fury is a fine young communist. He is not as cultivated as Titoman was(I wonder what he is doing) but he is getting smarter and smarter.
Also, the fact that some fourty thousand people die daily from undernurishment support his argument.
Best Regards: Vorosilov

Forty thousand people die each day from malnourishment? That is some incredible BS. I assume you are suggesting that all of these deaths occur in capitalist nations, and that the two or three communist states left in the world properly feed everyone. Considering the estimated birth rates for all nations, the rates of death for all other causes, and your claim that 40,000 people die each DAY from hunger, I think the environmental crowd can rest assured that the earth will win the battle against humanity before the twenty first century is complete. According to your numbers, everyone will be dead.

I used to think that only a communist can recite and believe such incredibly bogus statistics, and it is true that communists have a kind of monopoly on mindless recitation, but I recently heard a young college student here in the US give a speech on the evils of drunk driving (it is a bad thing) wherein she informed the audience that MILLIONS of people die in drunk driving related accidents each year in the US.

When I metioned to her later in the evening that her statistics were full of sh*t, and that the entire population of the country would be dead by now if her facts were based in reality, she responded like a true communist. She said that her facts were correct, as drunk driving is one of the greatest evils facing the nation, and that her sources would never lie. She suggested that my understanding was being obscured by propaganda set out by the liquor industry.

True believers. God love them. Freedom from thinking, freedom from all consequence. Just believe and feel good about it. Just like a communist.

[vorosilov]

[quote]Originally posted by Voyager13b

Forty thousand people die each day from malnourishment? That is some incredible BS. I assume you are suggesting that all of these deaths occur in capitalist nations, and that the two or three communist states left in the world properly feed everyone.

There is a nice tradition on Russia.com to say HELLO to each other.

Hello Voyager13b, welcome to Russia.com.

Good old Vorosilov never writes any BS. But I was wrong I have to admit to you. Because there are not 40000 people are dieing of malnourishment every day but 14 million children every and each year. Do the math yourself please.

Please don't assume anything about what I want to suggest.
I never suggest, I tell straight.

Statistics About The Hungry

"We are blessed to be a blessing! We gather the harvest of seeds to provide for one another and to plant seeds of hope for all nations of the earth. When we use our blessings to build bigger barns we neglect the stewardship of the earth and the welfare of humanity, our neighbors. Life on this planet is hard for most people:

Over 800 million people will go to bed hungry and re suffering from malnutrition

2.5 billion people are chronically undernourished, dying slowly and prematurely – approximately 400 million per day

Over 100 nations of our planet are in a state of malnutrition

Almost 40% of all malnourished are children; approximately 1 billion, 14 million die each year, which equals to 28 children dying each minute from starvation and the effects of malnutrition

Virtually every country in the world has the potential of growing sufficient food on a sustainable basis

Of the 6 billion people in today’s world, 1.2 billion live below $1.00 per day the wealthiest, 20%, of the world’s people ( of which the USA is a big part) consume an astonishing 86% of all goods and services, while the poorest 20% consume 1%

Web-sites to visit for more statistics: UNICEF http://www.unicef.org State of the Worlds children, United Nations http://www.fao.org

[vorosilov]

Dear Voyager13b,

KGB-CCCP is a very bright young man. I don't know what is your problem with him.

[Voyager13b]

Hello again Vorosilov,

I'm sorry, but I don't put any faith in numbers generated by the organizations that you listed. Their entire existance revolves around the mission of seperating developed nations from their money.

Considering that the population of the earth is somewhere between 4 and 6 billion, it is also a stretch to believe that nearly half a billion die (or nearly die) each day. At that rate, the entire population would be lost in a week or two.

Pointing out which countries consume the most food only serves to indicate which countries have determined to make food production a priority. It doesn't have a thing to do with with what is wrong with the countries that have too little food. While there are times when drought and other weather conditions cause famine, most often the cause is rooted in political and cultural problems. You suggest that we should stay out of private political matters, yet you demand that we feed the victims of such regimes.

Kind of like pissing on a bonfire while others pour gas on it. You might feel good to have attempted to put it out, but the fire still burns. If you want to reduce hunger, get rid of the corrupt governments in the tiny countries that continue to build personal wealth at the expense of their countrymen. Provide the hungry with the political power to change their situation as well as with food, and you offer them hope. That concept is hard for a communist to grasp, as it would seem to be much easier to take what someone else has, rather than to ask them for help in building your own.

By the way, I apologize for not offering a hello in my first post. Part of the pleasure of political debate is the intensity with which ideas are brought to the table. I read the dicussion, and started typing. The introduction was a casualty of my reaction. The battle is over ideas, so don't take such lapses as a personal attack. They are not. If I thought ill of you as a person, I wouldn't bother talking to you at all. Until next time!, enjoy.

[vorosilov]

Hello Voyager13b,

No problem, I am happy you are here to help out and save my friend Eyerowdy. Yopu can see how he answers my questions.
By swearing and profanity.

By the way, my numbers are correct. 14 million children die every year from hunger and hunger related sicknesses.