What Army Is The Best in The World

[p_panzerschreck]

Originally Posted by MaxPower

You all must study more

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern...orld_War_II%29

Also the book Russia's war which also is a series made in corporation with the bbc i think is a great book

The book is written by Richard Overy, he is a british professor and has won some awards for some of his work

Anyway study more

And if you dont want to read fact books maybe the book "life and fate" is for you

Why don't you do me a favour and tell me what went wrong, so I don't have to study all over again.
By the way, I got my facts from books and wikipedia.

[HATALbR]

Hi Lembitu:

Lembitu quote: You said: "The Germans couldn't have gone very far if Stalin used his brains."

How far did the Germans get...cold, hungry, frozen, ultimately defeated. The Germans underestimated the determination, ambition, perseverence, motivation & the will to live of the soviets (russians).

First & foremost...when it really counted...Stalin did use his brain. At first, he was rather not involved (leaving the decisions to his generals--with a yeh or ney) and inexperienced. Near the end of the war, I believe, he was considered experienced and genius (adapting & learning quickly). At the time he was actually connected to "the front" via direct communications he took control....did he not!?!

The most effective "war formation" was obviously the staggered "lines of defense." When, and if, the Germans broke through the shattered line would retreat inward toward the second line of defense and combine....the Germans were further & further away from reinforcements...becoming closer & closer to the
main concentration of soviet forces...

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What I would like to know (via archive records) is whether or not Stalin did indeed actually stay in Moscow, therefore, encouraging the overall Muscovite population to stay & fight...or if this was merely propaganda?

It was obviously not a safe condition for Stalin & I believe his entourage would have pressured him to leave--however, studying Stalin's personality, decision-making process & state of mind...I really do believe that Stalin stayed in Moscow...(ready to committ intellectual & pride suicide if necessary). He would have stabbed himself in the heart before letting a German take him...probably cursing them all to a hell unknown in the process...
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What do you think Lembitu?

Sincerely,
Natash


P.S. Lembitu quote: "sure that if germans had a city called Hitlersburg red army 100% sure tryed to take it in first place even if this operation was tactical and strategical madness."

Prosteetye! Stalin was on the DEFENSIVE....Of course the Germans (as you know) went after Stalingrad to degrade soviet/russian morale...the first motivation was PROTECTION, the second motivation was TAKE THE PRIZE...before the allied forces...further motivating his generals to fight for main military command..."Who's going to take Berlin."

[Marita]

Originally Posted by Lembitu

About Stalingrad - it was utmost stupidity from Germans to try to take it at the irst place. I think that point was in city name - if Stalingrad were called for example Gladejevsk I dont think that they were ordered to attack this place, but name STALINgrad decided all.
Im sure that if germans had a city called Hitlersburg red army 100% sure tryed to take it in first place even if this operation was tactical and strategical madness.

For example:
The city of Stalino - Donetsk since 1961
The city of Stalinogorsk - Novomoskovsk since 1961
Nevertheless, these cities were captured by Germans. And resistance of Stalingrad was incomparable.
So, such explanation is partly correct but not enough.

[HATALbR]

Marita:

Is your style to make random statements?

Is your style to make vague statements?

I have derived from your post no informational details whatsoever!

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Studying Stalin is my current passion...and I would appreciate a good challenge to drive the direction of my (independent) studies...if you come up with something of substance...I would very much like the opportunity to discuss the(se) issues with you.
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Ochin' Pryatna!
Natalie

[red^blade]

Stalin helped defeat the Germans so yes Stalin used his brains.

He also got his scientists to do massive research afterwards during the industrialization and that is why Russia has so many precious oil reserves which won't be running out any time soon

[derebail_33]

innitially before the war of the german with the ussr, germans and the ussr were friends like for example the partioning of poland between them remember? but in history there are silly flaws made and you see if german used ussr underequiped army for its own design rather than fighting with it could have easy won over the allies as the german were technologolically more advanced in terms of weapons ammunition transpotation etc the basic ameneties required in the war got it!

ok now lets go little forward even if nazi were doubled checked from both sides they could have done a recruitment drive in the countries they have ocupied for its own war plan think....just think what might have happened? if it has happened with a it change in the warfare instead of a regular war by the guierela warfare where the objectives are obtained with slight loses and with better efficiency offcource with some skill..then i belive even then nazi could have won the war in its own hands...

now about the when nazi captured stalingrad with an ease but had difficulty maintaing it later due to sniper situation in stalingrad they should have retreated temporalily and then ussr will obiosly think nazi are losing so they will occupy it but with one condition they should form three division one to attack the city from the east another from the north and last one from the south if this plan is done properly then the ussr will lose that city in few days then rest of ussr or atleast half of then will be conquered by the nazi easily...

about the african adventures by the nazi was bit costly ..... cause they dnt know desert warfare....if they have abandoned it in the start they would have saved a lot of firepower and manpower....think what might have happened if they have abandoned it....

lastly they should have started the war atleast two or three years late if they have done it they would have succesfully developed nuclear power it's true nazi were develeping nuclear power and they were the first in using jet powered aircraft if they have fitted all their warplanes with jet engines then i think nothing can beat nazi i swear .......

if all these condition's were done in a proper and well planned maner then i swear that the third reich will definetly be present for another 100 years as prophesied by adolf hittler.....

what do you think friends i know it is a fantasy and no one can turn back time to give this suggestion but if done they will be the unstopable force on earth!!!!!!

[p_panzerschreck]

DEREBAIL,
I think what you said were nothing but crap, except the last paragraph. Because when your article contained too many ifs, you article becomes crap. I’ll give you an a couple of examples, when Nazi Germany attacked Poland in 1939, the Western forces outnumbered the Germans 5:1, and the Allies did nothing but “bombard” Germany with peace fliers instead of bombs. But if the Allies attack Germany that time, it would be a different story. IF Stalin wasn’t so insecure about his position and didn’t do the purges, the Red Army might just be as powerful as Nazi Germany.

The Germans knew dessert warfare and went on pretty well with Rommel, but the Germans couldn’t compete with the Allies in sea battle, thus important supplies failed to arrive at Africa.

Jet engines were built in the US and Britain long before the Germans even knew of it; anyway the most important industrial areas were already bombed by the Allies at 1945, so all planes couldn’t be equipped.

Let’s say what you said came to pass, but Germany still might not win the war, you forgot about America. What if Einstein and his team worked a little harder and the A-bomb was ready in, let’s say 1943, Germany will still lose.

Things happen and will end how it should be, its destiny. OK, let’s say Germany created the A-bomb first in 1941, but because of one silly human error, the bomber carrying the bomb crashed right after it took of, and blew Berlin into bits. 60 years later, people might say: “If that idiot trained a little more, things will be different.” See the point I was trying to make?